I’ve read it a million times, “Things I Didn’t Know I Loved.” And that feeling of, you know, expansive affection for the world. My father, the Palestinian in our family, the full Palestinian, was a very hopeful man. I’ve found myself reading the great Palestinian Mahmoud Darwish with kind of a different sense of comprehension of his many, many decades of exile, because I think so many people in the world feel kind of just in exile from normalcy, from their regular lives. Artists began to use their own literary and artistic genre of art to work and reflect on another art to illuminate what the eye might not see in the original, to elevate it and possibly even surpass it. And human beings, no matter their particular heritage, I mean, I don’t know if suffering feels that different. I didn’t ever imagine writing poems in his voice, but since I was using his actual lines as titles in that book, the poems came out in his voice. Naomi Shihab Nye: It’s like the vitamin that helps you right away. In the middle of the night, he woke up and—he calls me Momo—and he said, “Momo?” And I said, “Yes?” He said, “I love you more than all my toys!”. You know, we’ve been talking about paying attention, and we’ve been talking about your father. It just got in shelves. Herman Melville's Moby Dick, or The Whale features an intense use of ekphrasis as a stylistic manifesto of the book in which it appears. Danez Smith: Two. Naomi Shihab Nye: Or, just yesterday, a friend was writing me from Honolulu and he had a bad experience with his car this week. Like what is the relationship between those two things, the like imperative to pay close attention and the like horror of the reality that you might be paying attention to? Merwin. 43. I appreciate them very much. Thank you for wanting me to come! According to the Poetry Foundation, "an ekphrastic poem is a vivid description of a scene or, more commonly, a work of art. “We’re pretty observant, more than some, less than others. And Grace used to say that she looked at politics as simply the way human beings treat one another. And some of the ways that poets, us included, were trying to hold the Poetry Foundation accountable, all of which is to say, we are at least going to be here for another season in 2021. Writers on art for a wider audience produced many descriptions with great literary as well as art historical merit; in English John Ruskin, both the most important journalistic critic and popularizer of historic art of his day, and Walter Pater, above all for his famous evocation of the Mona Lisa, are among the most notable. One example is a painting of a sculpture: the painting is "telling the story of" the sculpture, and so becoming a storyteller, as well as a story (work of art) itself. Hopefully, this is a pivotal moment when we’ll be able to make the future better for people who are 10 and 14. Danez Smith: Are you kidding, this is like having Beyoncé on here. Oh, let’s thank some people and go cry. Fingernail. So I have to go look it up. Just simple language and being with the Earth. Oh, wow. It’s like, such a beautiful thing to see that next generation of, like, the poem that I that I like am in love with. It was this epitome, this template of the ideal form, that a craftsman or later an artist would try to reconstruct in his attempt to achieve perfection in his work, that was to manifest itself in ekphrasis at a later stage. I was like, oh, look at this like sweet, intimate moment, I can’t wait to, like, you know, be riding around with y’all’s kid and like, play it, like, “You wanna hear your parents talk?” (LAUGHS), Danez Smith: They’re smart. That was kind of fun to do. Franny Choi: Yeah. Yeah. 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